---

NYPOST.COM

ISRAEL'S NEW FEAR

By RALPH PETERS

July 17, 2006 -- SOMETHING big hasn't happened in the current round of
fighting between Israel and its terrorist foes. That absence
represents a potentially fatal change in Israeli policy.

For all of the air-attacks on targets in Lebanon, the Israeli Defense
Force has not sent in ground troops. If IDF tanks don't thrust across
the border in force in the next few days, it will reflect the greatest
crisis of will in Israel's history.

Israel is signaling its enemies that it's afraid to risk its soldiers'
lives. And the terrorists read the message clearly. This caution will
only encourage Israel's enemies - just when the seemingly inevitable
advent of Iranian nuclear weapons poses the greatest threat to Israel
since 1948.

Israel never squandered the lives of its soldiers. It couldn't afford
to. But in past crises a sense of necessity prevailed. The IDF did
what it had to do, and did it well for two generations. Then came the
long involvement in Lebanon, "Israel's Vietnam." It broke something
inside the IDF.

Is Israel's spirit of sacrifice dying? If so, it may prove fatal. Once
brilliant in the attack, the IDF has declined into a defensive mindset
that air-strikes can't camouflage. Meanwhile, the ruthlessness of
Israel's enemies has increased horrifically. They would sacrifice
millions of their own people to destroy Israel.

Perhaps the air campaign to date is only meant to prepare the
battlefield for a strike by ground forces. For Israel's sake, let's
hope so. Because Israel's enemies will only be unified - and never
defeated - by attacks from 15,000 feet.

Precision munitions can't turn the tide in struggles of the soul. And
the souls of men are Hezbollah's center of gravity.

Israeli decision-makers appear to have learned nothing from the
failure of our "Shock and Awe" air campaign against Saddam's regime.
After all the ludicrous claims that a sound-and-light show over
Baghdad would drive Saddam to surrender, the war had to be won the
old-fashioned way, with the Army and Marines battling their way to
Baghdad.

If the U.S. Air Force, with all its resources, couldn't break Saddam's
regime, IDF jets won't defeat Hezbollah - an organization with genuine
popular support - by blowing holes in runways in Beirut and
humiliating the Lebanese people. But that's about all that air power
acting alone can do.

One of the many frustrating aspects of Hezbollah is that, while it's
increasingly a potent, disciplined military force, it doesn't present
many conventional military targets. It's maddeningly difficult to find
dispersed clusters of terrorists - and it's impossible to corner and
kill them in significant numbers without boots on the ground.

Israel is making the American mistake of betting on technology to
defeat primal beliefs. The result is the opposite of the one desired:
Stand-off attacks only convince religion-fueled terrorists that we -
Americans or Israelis - lack the courage to "face them like men."

This time, it seems they're right. Israel's refusal to fight in the
spirit of Dayan and Sharon will boost the morale of Hezbollah
fighters, unify their supporters - and serve as a recruiting tool. In
the Muslim world, this round of fighting will count as a terrorist
win.

At present, Hezbollah is embarrassing Israel with its rocket attacks,
while Israel has yet to wound Hezbollah.

For all the capabilities of hi-tech weapons systems, this is a new age
of Cain-and-Abel warfare, of vicious close-in fighting in villages,
apartment blocks and olive groves. No reconnaissance system can locate
enemy warriors hiding in an urban labyrinth or a shaded village
courtyard. The grunts have to do it. As in the age of Joshua, David
and Solomon.

No one wants to pay a price in blood. But postponing the payment of an
unavoidable blood-price in war only raises the ultimate cost (another
lesson of Iraq). Without defeating Hezbollah on the ground - no matter
what it takes - Israel can't win.

Israel faces enormous challenges and metastasizing threats. Like
cancer, those threats will only grow worse if not treated
aggressively. By trying to establish "psychological leverage" over the
Lebanese government and population with attacks on the country's
civilian infrastructure, Israel played into the hands of its enemies
and came off as a bully in the eyes of the world. Attempts to wage
"war-lite" have a heavy price.

Israel is in a fight for its life, but looks irresolute for the first
time in its history. It appears shockingly weak where it counts most,
in strength of will. And will is one thing Israel's fanatical enemies
do not lack.

If, in the coming days, we do not hear the roar of IDF tanks pursuing
Israel's enemies, we may one day hear a new lament for the children of
Zion.

---

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 06:31:58 +0200, Joakim skrev:

> NYPOST.COM
>
> ISRAEL'S NEW FEAR
>
> By RALPH PETERS
>
> July 17, 2006 -- SOMETHING big hasn't happened in the current round of
> fighting between Israel and its terrorist foes. That absence
> represents a potentially fatal change in Israeli policy.
>
> For all of the air-attacks on targets in Lebanon, the Israeli Defense
> Force has not sent in ground troops.

Jo de har. IOF sendte tropper ind i Libanon i går:
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=2200764

Det var i øvrigt også i Libanon, at de israelske soldater blev
fanget og otte andre dræbt for nogen dage siden, så det er
slet ikke noget nyt eller "big" for den sags skyld.

IOF har bare forbandet dårlige erfaringer med at kæmpe mod
Hizbullah på landjorden (Hizbullah kan til forskel fra de
andre grupperinger uddele øretæver). Derfor trak Israel sig ud
af Libanon pånær Sheba Farms-området for nogen år siden - men
jo altså ikke helt ud, og det har kostet - som nu med det, der
har eskaleret krigen mellem Israel og Libanon.

Lige nu er der nogen, der drømmer om, at de denne gang kan
komme Hizbullah til livs; men det er ikke andet end
neocon-hybris, og det vil gå sig selv igen. Det kommer
selvfølgelig til at koste en masse uskyldige civile mennesker
liv og førlighed, mens det pågår, og ikke vil ikke øge Israels
sikkerhed en millimeter.


--
"If a lie is repeated often enough all the dumb jackasses in
the world not only get to believe it, they even swear by it."
--Billy Boy Franklin

---

"Henrik Svendsen" <HrSvendsen@msn.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:1p8qmsdvzguit.dlg@hrsvendsen.fqdn.th-h.de...
> On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 06:31:58 +0200, Joakim skrev:
>
>> NYPOST.COM
>>
>> ISRAEL'S NEW FEAR
>>
>> By RALPH PETERS
>>
>> July 17, 2006 -- SOMETHING big hasn't happened in the current round
>> of
>> fighting between Israel and its terrorist foes. That absence
>> represents a potentially fatal change in Israeli policy.
>>
>> For all of the air-attacks on targets in Lebanon, the Israeli
>> Defense
>> Force has not sent in ground troops.
>
> Jo de har. IOF sendte tropper ind i Libanon i går:
> http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=2200764

En erobring af et relativt lille område (Ghajar), som ligger helt op
til Israels grænse.

>
> Det var i øvrigt også i Libanon, at de israelske soldater blev
> fanget og otte andre dræbt for nogen dage siden, så det er
> slet ikke noget nyt eller "big" for den sags skyld.

Det er ganske enkelt ikke korrekt. Hizbollahs angreb blev begået på
israelsk territorium.

>
> IOF har bare forbandet dårlige erfaringer med at kæmpe mod
> Hizbullah på landjorden (Hizbullah kan til forskel fra de
> andre grupperinger uddele øretæver). Derfor trak Israel sig ud
> af Libanon pånær Sheba Farms-området for nogen år siden - men
> jo altså ikke helt ud, og det har kostet - som nu med det, der
> har eskaleret krigen mellem Israel og Libanon.

Den israelske tilbagetrækning fra Sydlibanon i 2000 skete efter samråd
med FN, som anerkendte at Shebaa farms var en del af Golan-højderne,
(syrisk territorium). Resolution 1559 vedtaget af FN's Sikkerhedsråd i
2004 er en klar tilkendegivelse heraf.

---

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 13:52:06 +0200, Joakim skrev:

> "Henrik Svendsen" <HrSvendsen@msn.com> skrev i en meddelelse
> news:1p8qmsdvzguit.dlg@hrsvendsen.fqdn.th-h.de...
>> On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 06:31:58 +0200, Joakim skrev:
>>
>>> NYPOST.COM
>>>
>>> ISRAEL'S NEW FEAR
>>>
>>> By RALPH PETERS
>>>
>>> July 17, 2006 -- SOMETHING big hasn't happened in the current round
>>> of
>>> fighting between Israel and its terrorist foes. That absence
>>> represents a potentially fatal change in Israeli policy.
>>>
>>> For all of the air-attacks on targets in Lebanon, the Israeli
>>> Defense
>>> Force has not sent in ground troops.
>>
>> Jo de har. IOF sendte tropper ind i Libanon i går:
>> http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=2200764
>
> En erobring af et relativt lille område (Ghajar), som ligger helt op
> til Israels grænse.
>
>>
>> Det var i øvrigt også i Libanon, at de israelske soldater blev
>> fanget og otte andre dræbt for nogen dage siden, så det er
>> slet ikke noget nyt eller "big" for den sags skyld.
>
> Det er ganske enkelt ikke korrekt. Hizbollahs angreb blev begået på
> israelsk territorium.

Niks. Du er velkommen til at vise, hvor på israelsk
territorie, tilfangetagelserne fandt sted og hvor på israelsk
territorie IOF-kampvognen kørte på en lebanesisk pansermine.


>> IOF har bare forbandet dårlige erfaringer med at kæmpe mod
>> Hizbullah på landjorden (Hizbullah kan til forskel fra de
>> andre grupperinger uddele øretæver). Derfor trak Israel sig ud
>> af Libanon pånær Sheba Farms-området for nogen år siden - men
>> jo altså ikke helt ud, og det har kostet - som nu med det, der
>> har eskaleret krigen mellem Israel og Libanon.
>
> Den israelske tilbagetrækning fra Sydlibanon i 2000 skete efter samråd
> med FN, som anerkendte at Shebaa farms var en del af Golan-højderne,
> (syrisk territorium). Resolution 1559 vedtaget af FN's Sikkerhedsråd i
> 2004 er en klar tilkendegivelse heraf.

Og Libanon siger, det er libanesisk territorium (Syrien
snuppede det fra Libanon i 50'erne). Under alle omstændigheder
er det ikke israelsk territorie.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebaa_Farms




--
Contempt, prior to complete investigation, enslaves men to
ignorance. - Dr. John Whitman Ray

---

"Henrik Svendsen" <HrSvendsen@msn.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:1i0tya8ayowgr.dlg@hrsvendsen.fqdn.th-h.de...

> Niks. Du er velkommen til at vise, hvor på israelsk
> territorie, tilfangetagelserne fandt sted og hvor på israelsk
> territorie IOF-kampvognen kørte på en lebanesisk pansermine.

Eight Israel Defense Forces soldiers were killed and two others were
abducted Wednesday in attacks by guerillas from the militant Hezbollah
organization.

Hezbollah leader Sheikh Hassan Nasrallah said Wednesday evening that a
prisoner exchange was the only way to secure the release of the
soldiers, who he said were being held in a "secure and remote"
location.

"No military operation will return them," Nasrallah told a news
conference in Beirut. "The prisoners will not be returned except
through one way: indirect negotiations and a trade."

The militants attacked two IDF armored Hummer jeeps patrolling along
the border with gunfire and explosives, in the midst of massive
shelling attacks on Israel's north. Three soldiers were killed in the
attack and two were taken hostage.

Later in the day, four IDF soldiers were apparently killed when their
tank hit a mine some 6 kilometers inside Lebanese territory.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/737634.html

CNN viste desuden billederne af de to sønderbombede jeeps. Her fremgik
det ganske tydeligt at køretøjerne befandt sig på den israelske side
af sikkerhedshegnet.


> Og Libanon siger, det er libanesisk territorium (Syrien
> snuppede det fra Libanon i 50'erne). Under alle omstændigheder
> er det ikke israelsk territorie.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebaa_Farms
>

Du overser pointen. Sheeba farms er alene et anliggende ml. Israel og
Syrien iht. FN. Libanons krav på Sheeba farms giver Hizbollah det
nødvendige påskud for at kunne fortsætte angrebene på Israel.

http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs/2000/20000618.sc6878.doc.html

Presidential Statement Notes Reports of Violations, Calls upon Parties
to Respect Line Identified by United Nations

After consultations throughout the weekend, the Security Council this
afternoon endorsed the work done by the United Nations as mandated by
the Security Council, including the Secretary-General's conclusion
that, as of 16 June, Israel had withdrawn its forces from Lebanon in
accordance with Security Council resolution 425 (1978).

In a statement read out by.......

---

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 20:27:14 +0200, Joakim skrev:

> "Henrik Svendsen" <HrSvendsen@msn.com> skrev i en meddelelse
> news:1i0tya8ayowgr.dlg@hrsvendsen.fqdn.th-h.de...
>
>> Niks. Du er velkommen til at vise, hvor på israelsk
>> territorie, tilfangetagelserne fandt sted og hvor på israelsk
>> territorie IOF-kampvognen kørte på en lebanesisk pansermine.
>
> Eight Israel Defense Forces soldiers were killed and two others were
> abducted Wednesday in attacks by guerillas from the militant Hezbollah
> organization.
>
> Hezbollah leader Sheikh Hassan Nasrallah said Wednesday evening that a
> prisoner exchange was the only way to secure the release of the
> soldiers, who he said were being held in a "secure and remote"
> location.
>
> "No military operation will return them," Nasrallah told a news
> conference in Beirut. "The prisoners will not be returned except
> through one way: indirect negotiations and a trade."
>
> The militants attacked two IDF armored Hummer jeeps patrolling along
> the border with gunfire and explosives, in the midst of massive
> shelling attacks on Israel's north. Three soldiers were killed in the
> attack and two were taken hostage.
>
> Later in the day, four IDF soldiers were apparently killed when their
> tank hit a mine some 6 kilometers inside Lebanese territory.
>
> http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/737634.html

Tja, jeg kan finde artikler, der siger, at tilfangetagelsen
skete på libanesisk territorie.
http://www.justlanded.com/english/spain/tools/news/rajoy_cranks_up_pressure

Men okay - indtil jeg ser nogen beviser, vil jeg forholde mig
åbent til spørgsmålet.

> CNN viste desuden billederne af de to sønderbombede jeeps. Her fremgik
> det ganske tydeligt at køretøjerne befandt sig på den israelske side
> af sikkerhedshegnet.

Israelerne har det med at sætte hegn om områder, der ikke
tilhører dem - vi kender det allesammen fra Vestbredden; men
heller ikke forhold til Libanon kan israelerne dy sig:
http://english.people.com.cn/english/200106/02/eng20010602_71613.html

>> Og Libanon siger, det er libanesisk territorium (Syrien
>> snuppede det fra Libanon i 50'erne). Under alle omstændigheder
>> er det ikke israelsk territorie.
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebaa_Farms
>>
>
> Du overser pointen. Sheeba farms er alene et anliggende ml. Israel og
> Syrien iht. FN. Libanons krav på Sheeba farms giver Hizbollah det
> nødvendige påskud for at kunne fortsætte angrebene på Israel.
>
> http://www.un.org/News/Press/docs/2000/20000618.sc6878.doc.html
>
> Presidential Statement Notes Reports of Violations, Calls upon Parties
> to Respect Line Identified by United Nations
>
> After consultations throughout the weekend, the Security Council this
> afternoon endorsed the work done by the United Nations as mandated by
> the Security Council, including the Secretary-General's conclusion
> that, as of 16 June, Israel had withdrawn its forces from Lebanon in
> accordance with Security Council resolution 425 (1978).
>
> In a statement read out by.......

Libanon gør massivt krav på Shebaa Farms.
http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=1&categ_id=2&article_id=22963

Så ifølge den libanesiske regering holder Israel stadig en del
af Libanon besat.


--
"Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes,
that he also believes to be true." --Demosthenes

---

"Henrik Svendsen" <HrSvendsen@msn.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:11ssopw3dcev8.dlg@hrsvendsen.fqdn.th-h.de...

> Tja, jeg kan finde artikler, der siger, at tilfangetagelsen
> skete på libanesisk territorie.
> http://www.justlanded.com/english/spain/tools/news/rajoy_cranks_up_pressure
>
> Men okay - indtil jeg ser nogen beviser, vil jeg forholde mig
> åbent til spørgsmålet.

Jamen, gør du endelig det.

> Israelerne har det med at sætte hegn om områder, der ikke
> tilhører dem - vi kender det allesammen fra Vestbredden; men
> heller ikke forhold til Libanon kan israelerne dy sig:
> http://english.people.com.cn/english/200106/02/eng20010602_71613.html

Igen. Din artikel omhandler området omkring Ghajar, som Libanon nu gør
krav på.

> Så ifølge den libanesiske regering holder Israel stadig en del
> af Libanon besat.

Vi tager den lige en gang til. Uddrag fra mit tidligere link:

"Notwithstanding their reservations, both governments (red. Libanon og
Israel) have confirmed that establishing the identifying line was the
sole responsibility of the United Nations, the Secretary-General
notes, and that they would respect the line the United Nations'
identified".

Og i dag kan vi således konstatere, at Libanon alligevel ikke holdt
sit løfte om at respektere den blå line. Det er de nøgne facts.

---

"Joakim" <ncm_abfjern@hotmail.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:44bc6441$0$15795$14726298@news.sunsite.dk...
> NYPOST.COM
>
> ISRAEL'S NEW FEAR
>
> By RALPH PETERS
>
> July 17, 2006 -- SOMETHING big hasn't happened in the current round of
> fighting between Israel and its terrorist foes. That absence
> represents a potentially fatal change in Israeli policy.
>
> For all of the air-attacks on targets in Lebanon, the Israeli Defense
> Force has not sent in ground troops. If IDF tanks don't thrust across
> the border in force in the next few days, it will reflect the greatest
> crisis of will in Israel's history.
>
> Israel is signaling its enemies that it's afraid to risk its soldiers'
> lives. And the terrorists read the message clearly. This caution will
> only encourage Israel's enemies - just when the seemingly inevitable
> advent of Iranian nuclear weapons poses the greatest threat to Israel
> since 1948.
>
> Israel never squandered the lives of its soldiers. It couldn't afford
> to. But in past crises a sense of necessity prevailed. The IDF did
> what it had to do, and did it well for two generations. Then came the
> long involvement in Lebanon, "Israel's Vietnam." It broke something
> inside the IDF.
>

Sikken en gang pladder, USA gennembombede Irak i 90 dage i 1992, gik ind og
tog landet på 4-5 dage, det kostede 92 soldater livet (og de 49 blev skudt
ned af en amerikansk helikopter). Det er simpel fornuft at gøre modstanderen
mør med bomber før man sender tropperne ind.

mvh
Kim

---

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 11:42:15 +0200, "Kim2000" <kim2000@surfmail.dk>
wrote:

>> Israel never squandered the lives of its soldiers. It couldn't afford
>> to. But in past crises a sense of necessity prevailed. The IDF did
>> what it had to do, and did it well for two generations. Then came the
>> long involvement in Lebanon, "Israel's Vietnam." It broke something
>> inside the IDF.
>>
>
>Sikken en gang pladder, USA gennembombede Irak i 90 dage i 1992, gik ind og
>tog landet på 4-5 dage, det kostede 92 soldater livet (og de 49 blev skudt
>ned af en amerikansk helikopter). Det er simpel fornuft at gøre modstanderen
>mør med bomber før man sender tropperne ind.

Pladderet er da dit, USA behersker stadig ikke Irak, de patruljerer
kun i bestemte dele af landet, og deres soldater er spærret inde bag
store sikringsanordninger for at undgå at blive angrebet.

Regards Croc®

---

"Kim2000" <kim2000@surfmail.dk> skrev i en meddelelse
news:44bcacf7$0$14037$edfadb0f@dread15.news.tele.dk...

> Sikken en gang pladder, USA gennembombede Irak i 90 dage i 1992, gik
> ind og tog landet på 4-5 dage, det kostede 92 soldater livet (og de
> 49 blev skudt ned af en amerikansk helikopter).

Jo, men det gælder kun de konventionelle irakiske styrker. USA har som
bekendt ikke overvundet den irakiske guerilla.

Det er simpel fornuft at gøre modstanderen
> mør med bomber før man sender tropperne ind.
>

Ja, men indtil videre er der ikke meget, som tyder på at Israel
planlægger en landinvasion. Men det må tiden vise.

---

Joakim <ncm_abfjern@hotmail.com> wrote:

> NYPOST.COM
>
> ISRAEL'S NEW FEAR
>
> By RALPH PETERS
>
> July 17, 2006 -- SOMETHING big hasn't happened in the current round of
> fighting between Israel and its terrorist foes. That absence
> represents a potentially fatal change in Israeli policy.
>
> For all of the air-attacks on targets in Lebanon, the Israeli Defense
> Force has not sent in ground troops. If IDF tanks don't thrust across
> the border in force in the next few days, it will reflect the greatest
> crisis of will in Israel's history.

[Snip]
>
> If, in the coming days, we do not hear the roar of IDF tanks pursuing
> Israel's enemies, we may one day hear a new lament for the children of
> Zion.

Hvad var det Israel forsøgte i hele perioden 1982-2000 hvor de holdt det
sydlige Libanon besat???

Joakim, du er idiot, hvis du tror israelerne kan udrette dét som de
mislykkedes med over 18 år i løbet af nogle uger, måneder eller sågar
nogle få år!

Det er revnende ligegyldigt hvor meget Israel bomber eller hvor mange
landtropper og tanks de sætter ind i Sydlibanon. Hizbollah er en
guerillagruppe, verdens bedste til det de gør:At lege kispus med
fjenden. Fjenden, Israel derimod, de kommer bare til at forbløde i
Sydlibanon, hvis de blliver stående dér, det viser al erfaring.

Israel udkæmper en David og Goliath kamp mod Hizbollah og her er det
Israel der er Goliathen der nok har den store kølle, men som ikke er
adræt nok til at ramme David.

Det er Israel der har nøglen til fred og den nølge hedder
tilbagetrækning fra alle de områder som de ulovligt holder besat og
lukning af alle bosættelserne.Men tilsyneladende betyder Storisrael
drømmene mere for zionisterne end freden gør!
--
Jesper
"Neither Jewish morality nor Jewish tradition can
negate the use of terror as a means of battle."
(He Khazit, Lehi underground newspaper, 1943)